In a message dated 8/9/99 5:29:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time, kennedyp@toronto.cbc.ca writes: << I hate to jump in here, to add my 2 cents worth (...not quite qualifying for the pensioner's discount yet) from the advanced age of 48 (with a 25th wedding anniversary coming up on 9/9/99!), but I have to say I'm with Carl ALL THE WAY on this one.... If a guy can't dream at the age of 16, he'll INEVITABLY end up in the poisonous 'reality' of certain sophisticated twenty-somethings I've met.... Cheers, Paul >> There's really nothing "poisonous" about having realistic expectations for relationships, Paul. About not "making someone your religion," but having a healthy sense of self OUTSIDE the relationship then bringing that into it -- thus being a giving agent in the relationship instead of needy and dependent. Or about being "best friends" with your mate first, THEN getting romantic. But I see more of what Carl meant as of his second post and I like what he's shooting for :) Jim PS I'm older than twentysomething, have been married seventeen years myself and have four children, the oldest of which is 15. Not to mention some experience in marriage counseling...