Good post, Brad. I think there's a line between what is there and what isn't there in a text; between what exists in the text and what readers put into it. But I think that line is large, gray and fuzzy. I'm pretty wary whenever anyone says, "ANYTIME Holden says this...", whatever the "this" may be, because few texts use symbolism that way. OF COURSE people can use the words "subtext" and "subconscious" to allow them to say anything they want about a text, but that doesn't validate their claims. I think if symbolism is used it's usually explained or revealed within the course of the narrative without reference to anything outside the text. We really had a problem with "A Perfect Day for Bananafish" because some items--the color yellow, feet, trees, seemed to be recurring, making us think they were meaningful, yet we couldn't necessarily pin down a meaning. In that story I'd tend to allow the conversations between characters fill the objects with meaning. I think, for example, in the elevator, Seymour was dealing with the adult woman who came in on a child's level, with a child's candor, etc. So it didn't fly, while it with Sybil. Jim _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]