From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 5 19:35:13 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i45NZDn02243 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 5 May 2004 19:35:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200404301724.i3UHOn14011125@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: DaDa Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 17:24:48 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org There you go Ana, you just experienced a postmodernist in his native habitat, in situ. Usually they are nocturnal to take advantage of their acquired natural camouflage but since their natural predators are becoming rare they have been found more frequently, of late, in the day light. It seems however that their acquired adaptations to the dark have made them poorly adapted, unfit, to diurnal activity. There is some speculation by several prominent fideloligists that the actual photons in unfiltered light damage them at a cellular level. Daniel Ha...that's sure how I'd treat it, then, if I were in your position :). No, no, not serbo-croatian...I know Serbian AND Croatian. The article you posted isn't exactly groundbreaking: postmodernism has been seen as a footnote to modernism for quite some time now by quite a few people. The word "postmodern," from what I understand, was coined not long after the word "modernism" was used to describe the scientism of people like Freud, Marx, and Darwin -- I think in the 1920s or so. May have been in Germany. Need to look this up. I vaguely remember that the Catholic Church used the word "modernism" and Lutheran theologians said, "hey, we're already past that...we're postmodern." I think part of the problem is that the words "modernism" are being applied to different things here. In philosophy it's used to describe Freud/Marx/Darwin/etc. and the metanarrative of human existence and development they built up in place of the narratives previously provided by religion. So "postmodernism" in Baudrillard and Lytoard, say, would be a reversal of those along with all other metanarratives. But "modernism" in literary studies refers to a specific group of authors: Eliot, Woolf, HD, Pound, Lewis, etc., and these authors were talking about how It's All Fallen Apart On Us from the very start. It's possible the article you posted is really pointing out these two different uses of the word: modernism in literature dealt with postmodern themes to begin with. To further complicate things, "modernism" in art and political science have different referents too. The "modern state," some argue, is hundreds of years old, while others say it just dates from the 18-19th centuries. Since the categories were artificial to begin with...so what? I'd rather understand the phiilosophers and the poets themselves. If the categories help (they generally do), great. When they don't, well, I ignore them. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 5 19:35:16 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i45NZGF02249 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 5 May 2004 19:35:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Originating-IP: [193.198.146.194] X-Originating-Email: [anabuneta@hotmail.com] X-Sender: anabuneta@hotmail.com From: "ana" To: "BananaFish" References: <4092550D.70107@drew.edu> Subject: Re: DaDa Date: Thu, 6 May 2004 00:56:07 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 May 2004 23:02:08.0693 (UTC) FILETIME=[FDEF1650:01C432F4] Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org > Ha...that's sure how I'd treat it, then, if I were in your position :). > No, no, not serbo-croatian...I know Serbian AND Croatian. oh, we finally understand each other :) > The article you posted isn't exactly groundbreaking: postmodernism has > been seen as a footnote to modernism for quite some time now by quite a > few people. > It's possible the article you posted is really pointing out these two > different uses of the word: modernism in literature dealt with > postmodern themes to begin with. I don't think it is grundbreaking, but I liked it. I have similar dilemma as last time: did you read it? because, from what I understood he is trying to distinguish use of 'postmodernism' in different area: literature/art and philosophy. So Dada is art movement, but he is showing some philosophicaly idea and perception of the world of dadaists... which are the same/similar as those of Baudrillard, Lyotard etc. I won't repeat the article now, but I agree with some of the things said. .. bla > Since the categories were artificial to begin with...so what? I'd > rather understand the phiilosophers and the poets themselves. If the > categories help (they generally do), great. When they don't, well, I > ignore them. well that's ok. i agree. but few things a) you can discuss author and/or theory. he is discussing the theory (of certain author(s)) and even author(s) b) I adore dada, and understand it different then any other period in art/literature. first of all it is movement. second it is not arificial in a sense other categories are. In a way I never looked dada through any particular artist (although I have some favorites, of course :)) but I guess you are not talking about dada here. if you are talking about postmodernism, I would say that it should be (re)examine. if you would rather understand Baudrillard, I think Locher article is putting good questions on Baudrillard, frome aspect he is discussing. I find it interesting: the possible influence of Dada that were never mentoined.... bla to tiered to write... and think. ' night. ><><>< ana ======== Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, does not go away. --- Philip K. Dick - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Fri May 7 18:13:39 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i47MDdx00478 for bananafish-outgoing; Fri, 7 May 2004 18:13:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <409A45C1.7080204@drew.edu> Date: Thu, 06 May 2004 10:03:45 -0400 From: James Rovira Organization: Drew University User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: DaDa References: <200404301724.i3UHOn14011125@theseus.peterson.af.mil> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Ha...dear God, now I'm a postmodernist! :) And all this time I was thinking it was BS. Postmodernism in most people's mouths is just a "cool" way of saying "cultural relativism." But in most people's minds it's not thought through that far. Jim Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE wrote: >There you go Ana, you just experienced a postmodernist in his native >habitat, in situ. Usually they are nocturnal to take advantage of their >acquired natural camouflage but since their natural predators are becoming >rare they have been found more frequently, of late, in the day light. It >seems however that their acquired adaptations to the dark have made them >poorly adapted, unfit, to diurnal activity. There is some speculation by >several prominent fideloligists that the actual photons in unfiltered light >damage them at a cellular level. >Daniel > > > - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Fri May 7 18:13:40 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i47MDeA00490 for bananafish-outgoing; Fri, 7 May 2004 18:13:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Originating-IP: [193.198.147.104] X-Originating-Email: [anabuneta@hotmail.com] X-Sender: anabuneta@hotmail.com From: "ana" To: References: <200404301724.i3UHOn14011125@theseus.peterson.af.mil> Subject: Re: DaDa Date: Thu, 6 May 2004 22:30:12 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 May 2004 20:49:20.0552 (UTC) FILETIME=[9AF70280:01C433AB] Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org :)) interesting D. do you have any references? :)) ><><>< ab ----- Original Message ----- From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 7:24 PM Subject: RE: DaDa > There you go Ana, you just experienced a postmodernist in his native > habitat, in situ. Usually they are nocturnal to take advantage of their > acquired natural camouflage but since their natural predators are becoming > rare they have been found more frequently, of late, in the day light. It > seems however that their acquired adaptations to the dark have made them > poorly adapted, unfit, to diurnal activity. There is some speculation by > several prominent fideloligists that the actual photons in unfiltered light > damage them at a cellular level. > Daniel > - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Fri May 7 18:13:40 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i47MDeC00500 for bananafish-outgoing; Fri, 7 May 2004 18:13:40 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Date: Fri, 7 May 2004 14:27:36 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Index: AcQ0aVpTq3BhBP/sS4ipeQHGJTlUFA== From: "Mike Fischer" Importance: normal To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 May 2004 19:27:36.0917 (UTC) FILETIME=[5A957050:01C43469] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by dont.panix.com id i47JS7p23082 Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org New to the list, and just wanted to say hello to everybody This message is intended only for the use of the individual(s) or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential, and/or proprietary to M/PF Research and its affiliated companies. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, forwarding or copying of this communication is prohibited without the express permission of the sender. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original message. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Fri May 7 18:13:39 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i47MDde00484 for bananafish-outgoing; Fri, 7 May 2004 18:13:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <409A46E3.5020704@drew.edu> Date: Thu, 06 May 2004 10:08:35 -0400 From: James Rovira Organization: Drew University User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: DaDa References: <4092550D.70107@drew.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Responses below... ana wrote: >I don't think it is grundbreaking, but I liked it. I have similar dilemma as >last time: did you read it? >because, from what I understood he is trying to distinguish use of >'postmodernism' in different area: literature/art and philosophy. >So Dada is art movement, but he is showing some philosophicaly idea and >perception of the world of dadaists... which are the same/similar as those >of Baudrillard, Lyotard etc. >I won't repeat the article now, but I agree with some of the things said. >.. >bla > Nah, just read part of it. I think I still have the link in my old e-mail, but in case I don't, can you resend? >well that's ok. i agree. but few things >a) you can discuss author and/or theory. he is discussing the theory (of >certain author(s)) and even author(s) >b) I adore dada, and understand it different then any other period in >art/literature. first of all it is movement. second it is not arificial in a >sense other categories are. In a way I never looked dada through any >particular artist (although I have some favorites, of course :)) >but I guess you are not talking about dada here. if you are talking about >postmodernism, I would say that it should be (re)examine. if you would >rather understand Baudrillard, I think Locher article is putting good >questions on Baudrillard, frome aspect he is discussing. I find it >interesting: the possible influence of Dada that were never mentoined.... >bla >to tiered to write... and think. >' night. > > One thing I thought after sending my last response was that modernism in literature and modernism in art have a good bit more overlap than modernism in other fields. The literary-types had pretty close relationships with visual artists (say, Pound and Gaud(t?)ier-Brezska) and early journals like BLAST featured both art and literature. But I wouldn't argue with the idea that what's considered "postmodern" in some fields was represented in "modernist" art and literature. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 9 10:35:42 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i49EZgN29902 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 9 May 2004 10:35:42 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: About legal notices in email messages Date: Sat, 8 May 2004 16:15:06 -0400 Message-Id: <20040508201506.5641@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Fri, May 7, 2004, Mike.Fischer@MPFResearch.com said: >New to the list, and just wanted to say hello to everybody Hi, Mike! Welcome to the bananafish list, which at the moment is going through one of its quiet moments. But don't give up on us; we go through cycles here, lunar or loonier. >This message is intended only for the use of the individual(s) or entity >to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, >confidential, and/or proprietary to M/PF Research and its affiliated >companies. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, >you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, forwarding >or copying of this communication is prohibited without the express >permission of the sender. If you have received this communication in >error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original message. Oops! Or: House-keeping time. As the list caretaker, and to a lesser degree as a person who earns a living doing computer security and privacy and blah, blah, blah, I feel compelled to ask about your signature block. Sorry to be such a geek about this. A few other people have similar notes at the end of their email as well; however, nothing is quite as strong as yours. My concerns are as follows. List mail is archived monthly and of course goes to between 100 and 200 people per message, any of whom can read and forward it to non- subscribers; in addition, the web site makes your mail to the list available to anyone who has an account that can reach the Internet and that has basic web access. If this mail is coming via your work account, and if that account has all these conditions set upon it, I must ask: is it OK with your management for you to send personal or recreational mail to this list from your work account? Could it get you in trouble for doing this? Could it get me in trouble for allowing your messages to go through, in spite of the disclaimer in your signature block? The condition of "If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, forwarding or copying of this communication is prohibited without the express permission of the sender" worries me, because it's possible that you are not able to speak on behalf of your employer in these matters, so we are left with an exposed flank if your employer somehow objects to what you are doing with work-provided email. So, the two options I hope you will consider are: * possibly using a personal, non-employer email account for the list? or * providing me with appropriate (private) assurance from your office that you are explicitly allowed to use your account for this activity, thereby providing me the unfortunate legalistic coverage I need, to continue running this list with your work account subscribed to it, on the slight chance that your employer may be irked in the future, and may take action about the "intended recipient" and the "express permission"? I am sending this reply to all subscribers, because I have started to notice, slightly, an uptick of such signature blocks. To this point, the legalisms have been minor, but since this is a wave of the future, and since yours is so explicit a warning, I thought I'd let everyone see this, in the event that other employers deem it necessary to stick on such warning labels. I myself am required to use such a DREADFUL signature block at the end of mail, so of course I never do list work from my office unless it is on my own time. By the way: it is entirely possible, technically and, at least in the United States, legally, for a company to tack on such a disclaimer block even without the knowledge or approval of the sender. Here in the land of the free, under such work circumstances, your employer owns your mail, both physically (in terms of the data) and abstractly (in terms of the intellectual property contained in your mail). So .., my welcome is genuine, and this sort of message is quite the aberration! I hope you will join in discussions -- but please let me know about the thorny legal matters, so I won't lie awake at night grinding my teeth. I hope all this doesn't drive you away! Cheers, --tim o'connor - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 9 11:31:59 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i49FVxk01885 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 9 May 2004 11:31:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: A Ghost in Manhattan Date: Sun, 9 May 2004 10:52:23 -0400 Message-Id: <20040509145223.11309@mail.panix.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Hi, all. I came across this tiny article in the Times: In a Town of Prying Eyes, the Most Private of Men By MARCUS BARAM Published: May 9, 2004 THAT tall, lanky, gray-haired figure loping down Broadway seems to blend into the crowd before ducking into the foyer of a prewar apartment building on the Upper West Side. No one raises an eyebrow or stops to shake his hand. No one seems to know that the man is one of America's most celebrated authors. Advertisement That's because he is also one of the city's most reclusive residents: Thomas Pynchon, the author of "Gravity's Rainbow" and a half-dozen or so other novels, who is as famous for his hatred of the spotlight as for his dense prose. Since about 1990, the 67-year-old author has, like so many before him, found great privacy in the crowded city. He hangs out with friends in his local coffee shop, shops for groceries with his wife, Melanie Jackson, a literary agent, and walks his son, a young teenager, to Riverside Park. Other literary recluses of the city, such as Don DeLillo and Kurt Vonnegut, occasionally agree to an interview. Not Mr. Pynchon. Upon publication of "Gravity's Rainbow" in 1973, he was hailed as one of the country's brightest young writers. But when a Time magazine photographer tracked him to an apartment in Mexico City, the author jumped out of a window, climbed onto a bus bound for the mountains, and stayed there, growing a mustache that was so unruly the locals called him Pancho Villa. Ever since, Mr. Pynchon has been remarkably successful at remaining anonymous; any portrait of him must be cobbled together from bits learned from fans, Web sites, previous reports and the like. Although he has lived in such media capitals as Los Angeles and New York, he has been photographed only very rarely in the last 40 years. When publications need a picture of him, they often a high school photo or a 1956 Navy picture. Mr. Pynchon's penchant for privacy has inspired many legends: that he actually is the fellow recluse J. D. Salinger, that he took the guise of a cranky Russian woman named Wanda Tinasky to send letters to the editor of a Northern California newspaper, that he was the Unabomber. But there have been a few intrusions on his privacy. Upon the publication of his novel "Mason & Dixon" in 1997, a reporter for The Sunday Times of London photographed him walking his son home from school. Mr. Pynchon quickly ran away, and later cursed when the reporter tried to shake his hand. Around that time, the admiration of Pynchon fans, many of whom share the author's paranoia and obsessiveness, reached a fever pitch. The climax was a Pynchon lookalike contest, held at KGB, a popular writers' bar in the East Village. "During the contest, a tall figure walked in, wearing a raincoat, a floppy hat and some sunglasses," said Fosco Dubini, who, with Donatello Dubini, explored the author's reclusive ways in their 2001 film, "Thomas Pynchon: A Journey Into the Mind of P." "He sat on a stool in the back, wearing a white dinner jacket, keeping on his sunglasses. When he noticed everyone staring, he got up abruptly and exited. Right away, people started whispering that it was Pynchon himself. But I don't think so." Despite his obsessive desire for privacy, Mr. Pynchon is apparently no misanthrope, at least according to Richard Lane, a film editor at NBC and a Pynchon enthusiast. "He's got a wife and son whom he adores,'' Mr. Lane said. "He attends the birthday parties of his kids' friends. He has close friends who deeply love him and recognize the sensitivity of the man." He likes New York, too. "He loved living here after graduating from Cornell,'' Mr. Lane added. "And there's plenty of cultural institutions where he can enjoy his favorites, jazz and movies." NEW York has been home, for varying periods of time, to other secretive famous people: Herman Melville, Harper Lee, Elia Kazan, Richard Widmark, Robert Redford, Marcel Duchamp, Irving Berlin and Madame Chiang Kai-shek, who died in October at age 105. Greta Garbo lived for decades like a hermit on East 52nd Street until her death in 1990. "I was one of seven people who had her phone number," said Bobby Zarem, the publicist. Part of the city's appeal for recluses stems from the unspoken agreement between New Yorkers and the famous: acknowledge us with a wink, and we'll act cool and suppress our desire to jump up and down and ask for an autograph. Mr. Pynchon doesn't even have to go that far, of course. He has done such a great job of hiding in the city that no one would recognize him anyway. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 9 15:57:25 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i49JvPs10952 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 9 May 2004 15:57:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Omlor@aol.com Message-ID: <4b.3d913e12.2dcfc4f6@aol.com> Date: Sun, 9 May 2004 13:31:34 EDT Subject: Re: A Ghost in Manhattan To: bananafish@roughdraft.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_4b.3d913e12.2dcfc4f6_boundary" X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 10581 Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org --part1_4b.3d913e12.2dcfc4f6_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Tim, You know, I used to buy that whole "Pynchon as odd recluse" thing, until he showed up on The Simpsons, playing himself as a reclusive writer, wearing a paper bag over his animated head and trying to get people to pay to see him in person. And yup, in case you were wondering, that was really him doing himself on the show. How they got him to do the voiceover I still don't know. In any case, any writer who has been on The Simpsons is, by definition, a major literary figure in my book. All the best, --John --part1_4b.3d913e12.2dcfc4f6_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tim,

You know, I used to buy that whole "Pynchon as odd recluse" thing, until= he showed up on The Simpsons, playing himself as a reclusive writer, wearin= g a paper bag over his animated head and trying to get people to pay to see=20= him in person.

And yup, in case you were wondering, that was really him doing himself o= n the show.  How they got him to do the voiceover I still don't know.

In any case, any writer who has been on The Simpsons is, by definition,=20= a major literary figure in my book.

All the best,

--John
--part1_4b.3d913e12.2dcfc4f6_boundary-- - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 9 16:11:49 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i49KBnd11563 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 9 May 2004 16:11:49 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: Re: A Ghost in Manhattan Date: Sun, 9 May 2004 16:11:20 -0400 Message-Id: <20040509201120.12011@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <4b.3d913e12.2dcfc4f6@aol.com> References: <4b.3d913e12.2dcfc4f6@aol.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Sun, May 9, 2004, Omlor@aol.com said: >You know, I used to buy that whole "Pynchon as odd recluse" thing, until he >showed up on The Simpsons, playing himself as a reclusive writer, wearing a >paper bag over his animated head and trying to get people to pay to see >him in >person. > >And yup, in case you were wondering, that was really him doing himself on the >show. How they got him to do the voiceover I still don't know. > >In any case, any writer who has been on The Simpsons is, by definition, a >major literary figure in my book. Pynchon had a thing for a band a couple of years back. I think he wrote the liner notes and hung around the studio ... something like that -- my brain is very lazy today. I wish I could see the Simpsons show. I really get no references to pop culture, and, besides, what I have seen of it makes me laugh. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 11 19:50:57 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4BNove24114 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 11 May 2004 19:50:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <409F988E.4000109@drew.edu> Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 10:58:22 -0400 From: James Rovira User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, de, de-at, de-de, fr-fr, es-pr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: OT - FUN LINKS References: <40801C97.CC38.211E.000*/c=us/admd=/prmd=or.gov/o=HR/ou=gwise/s=Anello/g=Michael/i=J/@MHS> In-Reply-To: <40801C97.CC38.211E.000*/c=us/admd=/prmd=or.gov/o=HR/ou=gwise/s=Anello/g=Michael/i=J/@MHS> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org HA...thanks for posting that. The Ron-Tao is a riot. And I'm with you on Mitchell -- he won me over too. I'd rather read his translations of just about anything. Jim ANELLO Michael J wrote: >The Tao Te Ching - My heart still belongs to the Stephen Mitchell >version...but click on the link below to read the Ron Hogan version: > >http://www.terebess.hu/english/tao/ron.html > >While reading it, I experienced the same feeling when I listened to the reggae >version of Dark Side Of The Moon...a fresh breathe: > >http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&uid=UIDSUB040404131135092134&sql=Absug6j5371y0 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >- >* Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message >* UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH > > > - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 11 20:07:02 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4C072724960 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 11 May 2004 20:07:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405111725.i4BHPhER002099@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: DaDa dum, dum dum da Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:25:40 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Jim, all these years in the halls of higher 'self discovery' and you still get wrapped around that axel. Yes and yes Jim. Mouths? is that where it is lodged now days? Daniel Ha...dear God, now I'm a postmodernist! :) And all this time I was thinking it was BS. Postmodernism in most people's mouths is just a "cool" way of saying "cultural relativism." But in most people's minds it's not thought through that far. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 11 20:07:04 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4C074B24977 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 11 May 2004 20:07:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405111735.i4BHZAIq007192@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: DaDa Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:35:03 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Yah, I find D interesting also. Concerning references, which do you prefer? Friends? Family? Employers? I doubt if they will agree with us concerning our interest in D. Daniel interesting D. do you have any references? :)) ><><>< ab - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 11 20:07:03 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4C073s24972 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 11 May 2004 20:07:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405111729.i4BHThTb004032@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: DaDa Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:29:42 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Jim, I remember BLAST, and Jolt Cola (twice the sugar and all the caffeine) and Pop Rocks too. Daniel One thing I thought after sending my last response was that modernism in literature and modernism in art have a good bit more overlap than modernism in other fields. The literary-types had pretty close relationships with visual artists (say, Pound and Gaud(t?)ier-Brezska) and early journals like BLAST featured both art and literature. But I wouldn't argue with the idea that what's considered "postmodern" in some fields was represented in "modernist" art and literature. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 11 20:07:03 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4C073p24971 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 11 May 2004 20:07:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405111728.i4BHS0fh003305@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: Mike Fischer Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:27:59 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Great last name. Daniel New to the list, and just wanted to say hello to everybody - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sat May 15 15:49:27 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4FJnRV23365 for bananafish-outgoing; Sat, 15 May 2004 15:49:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Originating-IP: [193.198.146.105] X-Originating-Email: [anabuneta@hotmail.com] X-Sender: anabuneta@hotmail.com From: "ana" To: "BananaFish" References: <200405111735.i4BHZAIq007192@theseus.peterson.af.mil> Subject: Re: DaDa Date: Wed, 12 May 2004 12:34:11 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 May 2004 11:44:56.0060 (UTC) FILETIME=[8BE393C0:01C43816] Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org oh, well I prefer F... so friends, family will be fine. ><><>< ana F buneta President of the League for Protection of Phonem F > Yah, I find D interesting also. Concerning references, which do you prefer? > Friends? Family? Employers? I doubt if they will agree with us concerning > our interest in D. > Daniel - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sat May 15 15:49:27 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4FJnRM23366 for bananafish-outgoing; Sat, 15 May 2004 15:49:27 -0400 (EDT) X400-Received: by mta Salem-MTA1 in /c=US/admd= /prmd=or.gov/; Relayed; 12 May 2004 08:01:46 -0700 X400-Received: by /c=US/admd= /prmd=or.gov/; Relayed; 12 May 2004 08:01:46 -0700 X400-MTS-Identifier: [/c=US/admd= /prmd=or.gov/; 40A23C54.CC38.DB9A.000] Content-Identifier: 0429340A23C5A00A Content-Return: Allowed X400-Content-Type: P2-1988 ( 22 ) Conversion: Allowed Original-Encoded-Information-Types: IA5-Text Disclose-Recipients: Prohibited Alternate-Recipient: Allowed X400-Originator: Michael.J.Anello@state.or.us X400-Recipients: non-disclosure; Message-Id: <40A23C54.CC38.DB9A.000*/c=us/admd=/prmd=or.gov/o=HR/ou=gwise/s=Anello/g=Michael/i=J/@MHS> Date: 12 May 2004 08:01:46 -0700 From: ANELLO Michael J To: bananafish@roughdraft.org (IPM Return requested) (Receipt notification requested) Subject: RE: DaDa Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org i never tried the OK soft drink. i haven't felt alright about it since. -mike >>> daniel.yocum@Peterson.af.mil 05/11/04 05:07PM >>> Jim, I remember BLAST, and Jolt Cola (twice the sugar and all the caffeine) and Pop Rocks too. Daniel One thing I thought after sending my last response was that modernism in literature and modernism in art have a good bit more overlap than modernism in other fields. The literary-types had pretty close relationships with visual artists (say, Pound and Gaud(t?)ier-Brezska) and early journals like BLAST featured both art and literature. But I wouldn't argue with the idea that what's considered "postmodern" in some fields was represented in "modernist" art and literature. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sat May 15 17:30:08 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4FLU8i27134 for bananafish-outgoing; Sat, 15 May 2004 17:30:08 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: Greetings and some questions Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 16:37:04 -0400 Message-Id: <20040515203704.20475@mail.panix.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Hi, all. A couple of details, on a day when I finally have time to send mail.... First, I released a load of messages that had built up toward the end of the week. My apologies for the delay. They were in a pile that was deluged with offers for various prescription drugs, Nigerian scam letters (which I collect!), offers to increase or decrease the size of various body parts, and the usual "get rich free" tricks. Second (and more entertaining, I think): one subscriber sent a picture that could not be mailed out because it was larger than the mailing list allows. It's a great picture and it got me thinking: what if we create a separate choice on the web site that displays pictures (photos of subscribers would be specifically welcome)? Does anyone want to join in? Myself, I would be inclined to offer a self-portrait in ink rather than a photograph. I'm waiting to hear back from the subscriber who sent in his picture, which he suggests as a good target for a dartboard. I of course disagree with him (but politely), and I like the picture and am awaiting his approval to put it up. It is something like a magazine adding a new section. "Subscribers present themselves" ... it sounds good to me. (You poor newcomers are in for a shock, and at some point I expect to find a picture of one subscriber with hands around the throat of another subscriber.) Please respond to the list if you have comments; or you can always mail me privately when the need arises. Cheers, --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sat May 15 17:30:09 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4FLU9B27141 for bananafish-outgoing; Sat, 15 May 2004 17:30:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: New Yorker article & this year's Laughing Man Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 17:28:50 -0400 Message-Id: <20040515212850.21581@mail.panix.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Another note from the list caretaker, though this is not housekeeping news.... In a recent issue of the New Yorker, there is an exquisite article by Adam Gopnik, a brilliant NY'er contributer who entertained for years with his "Letter from Paris" series (many of them collected in the memoir of his family's stay in Paris, entitled "Paris to the Moon"). He was a longtime friend and former student of Kirk Varnedoe, the extraordinary Museum of Modern Art department head, who died in 2003 after a long bout with cancer. The article is (well, read it yourself, rather than listen to my delusional description from memory) ostensibly a tale of how Gopnik's son and the son's friends want to join or start a football team. Gopnik gets enlisted in the effort, but he calls upon Varnedoe, who was being aggressively treated for his cancer but who had been a very fine football player in his college days. So, Gopnik plays the part of narrator; Varnedoe is the coach presented to us through Gopnik's eyes, the modern version of John Gedsudski; and the kids are, well, the kids on the bus, and they call themselves "the Metrozoids." Their playground is Central Park. The story is beyond heartbreaking. Many of us fortunate enough to have heard Varnedoe's astonishingly brilliant lectures can only imagine the details Gopnik only touches upon. (Varnedoe was known for appearing in a lecture hall, with no notes, only a list of slides, and then, with the projector running, lecturing for two or three mesmerizing hours about art movements and history.) In the end, of course, there is an abiding sadness as the story winds down and we (but not the kids) observe through the narrator that Varnedoe is reaching a certain point where he will no longer be able to continue in his role as coach. There is also a lovely digression about Varnedoe's much-admired series of Mellon lectures at the (U.S.) National Gallery of Art, which were more or less his last public appearances. (So far, based on my digging, these lectures have not been made public on video or audio. Still, one wishes....) I hope you can locate it -- it was in the issue of May 10, 2004, entitled "Last of the Metrozoids"; unfortunately, I don't have the copy around anymore (it is lost in my miasma), though there is not much I could do even if I had it at hand. Read it, see what you think, feel free to discuss here. (Hint, hint.) Regards, --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sat May 15 17:30:09 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4FLU9827146 for bananafish-outgoing; Sat, 15 May 2004 17:30:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: Recent flood of junk mail Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 17:28:58 -0400 Message-Id: <20040515212858.6212@mail.panix.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Another housekeeping message: I slogged through several dozen mail messages that had accumulated between May 11 and today. There was the usual ghastly collection of the worst the Internet has to offer, and I tried to be competent about deleting the junk and approving the good stuff. However, THIS WEEK ONLY, I will say that there is a very slight chance that if you sent mail with one of the standard junk subjects "Something for you" or "Your Message!" or "Your Document," there is the chance that a legitimate message was not approved I'm sure that most of us are inundated with unwanted mail, so most of us know the deal about spam. Nonetheless, if you believe that your message is lost, mail me privately (tim@roughdraft.org) and let me know, and I'll see what I can do. The archive mailbox, which I use to extract the monthly archives, swelled from the normal 2MB of data to roughly 12MG -- one part good message to six parts junk! Anyway, that's something I hoped to pass along. Best to all. As always, if you are planning to come through New York this summer and are eager to socialize, please let the few of us city folk on the list know; perhaps we can arrange dinner or something. Thanks a lot! --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 16 00:12:12 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4G4CC914381 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 16 May 2004 00:12:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40A6C35E.40809@drew.edu> Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 21:26:54 -0400 From: James Rovira User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: Greetings and some questions References: <20040515203704.20475@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <20040515203704.20475@mail.panix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Pretty cool idea, Tim -- I guess they'd be something like "member profiles" with photographs? Interesting idea. Would it be a message board section on your site, or would listmembers have to submit profiles with or without photos, and you'd manually enter them? Jim Tim O'Connor wrote: > It's a great picture and it got me thinking: what if we create a >separate choice on the web site that displays pictures (photos of >subscribers would be specifically welcome)? Does anyone want to join in? > Myself, I would be inclined to offer a self-portrait in ink rather than >a photograph. I'm waiting to hear back from the subscriber who sent in >his picture, which he suggests as a good target for a dartboard. I of >course disagree with him (but politely), and I like the picture and am >awaiting his approval to put it up. It is something like a magazine >adding a new section. "Subscribers present themselves" ... it sounds >good to me. (You poor newcomers are in for a shock, and at some point I >expect to find a picture of one subscriber with hands around the throat >of another subscriber.) > > - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 16 14:12:15 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4GICFf17963 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 16 May 2004 14:12:15 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: Re: Greetings and some questions Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 14:10:39 -0400 Message-Id: <20040516181039.22345@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <40A6C35E.40809@drew.edu> References: <40A6C35E.40809@drew.edu> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Sat, May 15, 2004, jrovira@drew.edu said: >Pretty cool idea, Tim -- I guess they'd be something like "member >profiles" with photographs? Interesting idea. Would it be a message >board section on your site, or would listmembers have to submit profiles >with or without photos, and you'd manually enter them? All manual, I'm afraid. First off, one point is that this is not a "board" or "message board" or anything of the like. It's just an archive. Second is that live discussions are on a mailing list. I'm just clarifying that for people who may be newly arrived and may have a different idea of what this "bananafish" thing is all about. Second (wearing my computer security hat), there are entirely too many hacks against systems that allow you to interactively add data. So, being the safe fellow I am, I decided that I will keep it an archive (and now a picture gallery). As it is we get smacked with at least a dozen (and often more) messages a day that are junk mail. Any way of battening the hatches is good by me! If you have any contributions, please send them in, but note two details: * I have enormous demands on my time from work, so there will be times when things are delayed; indeed, I still need to put up the archives from after 12/2003, but am still awaiting time to do it. In fact, once I fire off this note, and approve it, I must return to the usual toil saved up as weekend punishment. * Next week (starting the 23rd, I think), I will be sort of on the road and moderately out of email touch. Don't despair if you mail in and don't get a reply or don't find your picture up. OK. So, with the kind permission of the owner of the image, I have our first submission. Go to the web site: http://www.roughdraft.org/JDS/lounge/ Do a cut-and-paste for best results.... Cheers, --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 16 19:20:13 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4GNKDP01495 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 16 May 2004 19:20:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40A7D51A.9020800@drew.edu> Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 16:54:50 -0400 From: James Rovira User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: Greetings and some questions References: <40A6C35E.40809@drew.edu> <20040516181039.22345@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <20040516181039.22345@mail.panix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Thanks for the reply, Tim. I was picturing a message board feature as separate section of your site for member profiles, but given the problems with spam....good lord, yes, you'd just have to be removing ads from that too. It happens on my website and it's Small. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Sun May 16 20:18:48 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4H0ImW03947 for bananafish-outgoing; Sun, 16 May 2004 20:18:48 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: Re: Greetings and some questions Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 20:03:08 -0400 Message-Id: <20040517000308.7400@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <40A7D51A.9020800@drew.edu> References: <40A7D51A.9020800@drew.edu> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Sun, May 16, 2004, jrovira@drew.edu said: >Thanks for the reply, Tim. I was picturing a message board feature as >separate section of your site for member profiles, but given the >problems with spam....good lord, yes, you'd just have to be removing ads >from that too. It happens on my website and it's Small. [Taking a break from work!] Thanks for knowing what I'm talking about. Just in the last 30 days I have seen ten or eleven web sites defaced (the eleventh was defaced by my analysis, but the owner says it was done by a disgruntled employee), and all of them used subsystems like php or some cgi-bin module that was carelessly installed. Some of these setups can be made safe, but it takes eternal vigilance. No member profiles, I fear ... just a simple text database of mailing addresses. Anyone can look at the pages, and sometimes it even gets someone to subscribe. I get a kick out of how Google gets so much attention because it's basically text on a white background. I did that with our web site years ago, chiefly because I never wanted to devote the time required to make HTML full of bells and whistles, tables and graphics, and essentially to become a part-time web administrator. Also, not a small decision at the time, people still came in through (slow) modems, and I had to keep the size of pages reasonably small. Five or six years ago, I would never have suggested a gallery of what Scottie calls "mugshots." There simply wasn't enough bandwidth between people at home and the Internet. That has changed in some places (but not in all), so I can kind of quietly slide this one in under the radar.... I hope to add more portraits soon! Self-portraits are especially good because then people get to make their own choice of what looks best. Sorry, back to work now. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Mon May 17 21:28:47 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4I1Sll13329 for bananafish-outgoing; Mon, 17 May 2004 21:28:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: more pictures! more pictures! Date: Mon, 17 May 2004 20:29:25 -0400 Message-Id: <20040518002925.8632@mail.panix.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Hi, all. Some promises made to send pictures, and a couple of new bananafish online. Check it out at www.roughdraft.org/JDS/lounge/ and see for yourself. So, send in pictures already (to me, not to the list). --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 18 10:36:16 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4IEaGC23043 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 18 May 2004 10:36:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40AA0E7F.5090302@drew.edu> Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 09:24:15 -0400 From: James Rovira User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, de, de-at, de-de, fr-fr, es-pr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: more pictures! more pictures! References: <20040518002925.8632@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <20040518002925.8632@mail.panix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Great photos, Tim. I'm glad you're doing this. Nice to finally see what Scottie looked like.... Jim Tim O'Connor wrote: >Hi, all. Some promises made to send pictures, and a couple of new >bananafish online. > - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 18 18:14:32 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4IMEWb15388 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 18 May 2004 18:14:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000801c43cfd$082436c0$57a57dc2@j8l6n9> From: "Scottie Bowman" To: References: <20040518002925.8632@mail.panix.com> <40AA0E7F.5090302@drew.edu> Subject: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 18:24:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Now that some of us have let vanity prevail over shame, surely the rest of the shoal can venture out from behind that rock. We're dying to have a peep. Honest. Scottie B. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 18 18:14:33 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4IMEX315392 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 18 May 2004 18:14:33 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40AA548C.1010809@drew.edu> Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 14:23:08 -0400 From: James Rovira Organization: Drew University User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Proust Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Last night I picked up Proust for the first time. I started _Swann's Way_ -- a pretty new translation, I think. Pretty funny because I was up late, unable to sleep, reading a first person account of a guy with sleeping problems who's reading himself to sleep, which then gives way to a description of the process of a reader identifying with a novel. Good freaking God :). Well, it's great. It's fllllluuuuuid. I feel now like I haven't really read in the field of modernism until I've read Proust. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 19 08:08:03 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4JC83g23429 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 19 May 2004 08:08:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000b01c43d79$2f3731a0$33a57dc2@j8l6n9> From: "Scottie Bowman" To: References: <200405182249.i4IMnQG0022763@theseus.peterson.af.mil> Subject: Re: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 09:12:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org I have just received - under plain cover & evidently for my own personal use - a superb studio photograph of one of our MOST distinguished members but who, by implication, asks to remain nameless. (Mind you, the hard hat, theodolite, rifle & pyotl plants are something of a giveaway.) While the face is rather grey & expressionless, the supporting torso glints with the kind of bronze sheen that I found churning up in my own breast feelings I never knew existed . I suspect he is too shy to accede to my request, but let me make a heartfelt plea that he release this gorgeous image for our more general pleasure. Scottie B. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 19 09:44:59 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4JDixc28288 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 19 May 2004 09:44:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40AB606B.5060002@drew.edu> Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 09:26:03 -0400 From: James Rovira User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, de, de-at, de-de, fr-fr, es-pr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: It's about time... References: <20040518002925.8632@mail.panix.com> <40AA0E7F.5090302@drew.edu> <000801c43cfd$082436c0$57a57dc2@j8l6n9> In-Reply-To: <000801c43cfd$082436c0$57a57dc2@j8l6n9> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Lake Superior State University Word Banishment selection committee emerged from its spider hole with its annual List of Words Banished from the Queen's English for Mis-Use, Over-Use, and General Uselessness. http://www.lssu.edu/banished/archive/2004.php - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 19 17:48:38 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4JLmcr24105 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 19 May 2004 17:48:38 -0400 (EDT) X400-Received: by mta Salem-MTA1 in /c=US/admd= /prmd=or.gov/; Relayed; 19 May 2004 08:07:40 -0700 X400-Received: by /c=US/admd= /prmd=or.gov/; Relayed; 19 May 2004 08:07:40 -0700 X400-MTS-Identifier: [/c=US/admd= /prmd=or.gov/; 40AB7835.CC38.A1F6.000] Content-Identifier: 022C640AB783C002 Content-Return: Allowed X400-Content-Type: P2-1988 ( 22 ) Conversion: Allowed Original-Encoded-Information-Types: IA5-Text Disclose-Recipients: Prohibited Alternate-Recipient: Allowed X400-Originator: Michael.J.Anello@state.or.us X400-Recipients: non-disclosure; Message-Id: <40AB7835.CC38.A1F6.000*/c=us/admd=/prmd=or.gov/o=HR/ou=gwise/s=Anello/g=Michael/i=J/@MHS> Date: 19 May 2004 08:07:40 -0700 From: ANELLO Michael J To: bananafish@roughdraft.org (IPM Return requested) (Receipt notification requested) Subject: Re: come on in - the water's lovely Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org alright, fine. i give my consent. -mike >>> rbowman@indigo.ie 05/19/04 05:08AM >>> I have just received - under plain cover & evidently for my own personal use - a superb studio photograph of one of our MOST distinguished members but who, by implication, asks to remain nameless. (Mind you, the hard hat, theodolite, rifle & pyotl plants are something of a giveaway.) While the face is rather grey & expressionless, the supporting torso glints with the kind of bronze sheen that I found churning up in my own breast feelings I never knew existed . I suspect he is too shy to accede to my request, but let me make a heartfelt plea that he release this gorgeous image for our more general pleasure. Scottie B. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 19 22:22:56 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4K2Muj06172 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 19 May 2004 22:22:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 22:21:05 -0400 From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: pictures: the flood cometh Message-ID: <20040520022105.GA26018@panix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Hello, all y'alls. I want to thank all you who sent in pictures (and I encourage those who have not: throw off the shackles of anonymity and join the fun; many winners to be had; you can get a daily digest of Nigerian scan messages about dead millionaires, you can learn about enlarging and reducing various body parts, and you can find many places that will sell you your favorite narcotics or benzodiazepines). I have been at work for about 13 hours today and so I regret that I have not yet processed the newest pictures, but I shall try to do a decent job of it tonight. I just realized that the entire message above came out in a perfect set of lines, though I did not write it that way. Perhaps all the hours of work are making me hallucinate. Cheers to all! --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Fri May 21 22:19:00 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4M2J0927927 for bananafish-outgoing; Fri, 21 May 2004 22:19:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 21:48:40 -0400 From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: delayed housekeeping Message-ID: <20040522014839.GA23328@panix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Again I want to thank people who sent me pictures privately. I am still mostly out of touch, and will be until Sunday. So, if you mail me, but don't get an answer, please know it is because I have but scant connectivity. Once I am finished, I should have a good base of operations and will do all one can do to get pictures up post-haste. (Thank you for your patience ... I rarely travel, and when I do I must be the world's worst traveler. Agoraphobic, airplane/airport-phobic, and other -phobics; perhaps Scottie can tell us what "fear of travel" is in the Greek rendering. I most certainly have that too. Though when I visited him and his charming wife in Cork, I managed to cope with that train ride.) Eventually I will be on the west coast of Florida in the Tampa Bay area, doing a computer consulting thing. Any Bananafish there? (I know of one, and plan to see him.) Thanks for listening. I will be far, far, from the beaches Seymour last saw ... but then I am sun-phobic too! I leave it to those who like puzzles to figure out exactly how much of this is joking and how much is genuine.... Cheers to all. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Fri May 21 22:18:59 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4M2IxA27916 for bananafish-outgoing; Fri, 21 May 2004 22:18:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Originating-IP: [63.84.198.180] X-Originating-Email: [holmesdavis@hotmail.com] X-Sender: holmesdavis@hotmail.com From: "Holmes Davis" To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: RE: It's about time... Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 11:18:50 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 May 2004 16:18:51.0320 (UTC) FILETIME=[235F3B80:01C43E86] Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Companion animals has got to be the funniest one on that list, it reminds me of that line from the movie Jerry McGuire when the nanny says he prefers to be called a "Child technician" >From: James Rovira >Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org >To: bananafish@roughdraft.org >Subject: It's about time... >Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 09:26:03 -0400 > >Lake Superior State University Word Banishment selection committee emerged >from its spider hole with its annual List of Words Banished from >the Queen's English for Mis-Use, Over-Use, and General Uselessness. > >http://www.lssu.edu/banished/archive/2004.php > >- >* Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message >* UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH _________________________________________________________________ MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – FREE download! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Fri May 21 22:18:59 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4M2IxJ27922 for bananafish-outgoing; Fri, 21 May 2004 22:18:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40AD1A49.3030302@drew.edu> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 16:51:21 -0400 From: James Rovira Organization: Drew University User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: New words from the Washington Post... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org ha! Jim 1. Coffee (n.), a person who is coughed upon. 2. Flabbergasted (adj.), appalled over how much weight you have gained. 3. Abdicate (v.), to give up all hope of ever having a flat stomach. 4. Esplanade (v.), to attempt an explanation while drunk. 5. Willy-nilly (adj.), impotent. 6. Negligent (adj.), describes a condition in which you absent-mindedly answer the door in your nightgown. 7. Lymph (v.), to walk with a lisp. 8. Gargoyle (n.), an olive-flavored mouthwash. 9. Flatulence (n.) the emergency vehicle that picks you up after you are run over by a steamroller 10. Balderdash (n.), a rapidly receding hairline. 11. Testicle (n.), a humorous question on an exam. 12. Rectitude (n.), the formal, dignified demeanor assumed by a proctologist immediately before he examines you. 13. Oyster (n.), a person who sprinkles his conversation with Yiddish expressions. 14. Pokemon (n), A Jamaican proctologist. 15. Frisbeetarianism (n.), The belief that, when you die, your Soul goes up on the roof and gets stuck there. 16. Circumvent (n.), the opening in the front of boxer shorts. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 10:20:30 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4PEKUr05713 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 10:20:30 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: More of the Rogues' Gallery Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 10:17:28 -0400 Message-Id: <20040525141728.24436@mail.panix.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Howdy. I wanted to let all you visually inclined folks know that I've updated the picture gallery as of this morning. We have 10 pictures of ... various ... types. If you sent in your picture to me and it is not there, please let me know privately. I've had about 1500 spam messages since Sunday night, so it's slightly possible that your message went astray. So, have fun: http://www.roughdraft.org/JDS/lounge/ Best, --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 20:26:58 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q0QwX05327 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 20:26:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405252051.i4PKpiEC013320@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: New Yorker article & this year's Laughing Man Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:51:40 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org I saw this guy on Charlie Rose. I watch that show, maybe, twice a month tops and you have mentioned just about every guest I've seen. Do you NYer lit types roam around in herds, or what? Daniel I hope you can locate it -- it was in the issue of May 10, 2004, entitled "Last of the Metrozoids"; unfortunately, I don't have the copy around anymore (it is lost in my miasma), though there is not much I could do even if I had it at hand. Read it, see what you think, feel free to discuss here. (Hint, hint.) Regards, --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 20:26:58 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q0Qwj05339 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 20:26:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405252058.i4PKwpgO016618@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: more pictures! more pictures! Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:58:50 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Come on guys, every time I open that web page I get the feeling I'm passing time in line at the post office. Daniel Great photos, Tim. I'm glad you're doing this. Nice to finally see what Scottie looked like.... Jim Tim O'Connor wrote: >Hi, all. Some promises made to send pictures, and a couple of new >bananafish online. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 20:26:58 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q0QwJ05333 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 20:26:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405252055.i4PKtr7d015259@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: Greetings and some questions Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:55:52 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Jim, you have the soul of a clerk. I picture you in a mega office supply store like Office Depot or Office Max standing in the file folder aisle with hunched shoulders glazed eyes and a puddle of piss pooling about your feet. Daniel Thanks for the reply, Tim. I was picturing a message board feature as separate section of your site for member profiles, but given the problems with spam....good lord, yes, you'd just have to be removing ads from that too. It happens on my website and it's Small. Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 20:26:59 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q0QxH05350 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 20:26:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405252115.i4PLFw7B025199@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 21:15:55 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org I was about to delete this today without further thought when I noticed that you ended with an appeal to pleasure. Far be it from me to retard the general pleasure, by all means, bear your breast to all and display your previously unrevealed feelings. Release them to churn within the corporate breast as well. Daniel (you know Scottie, after this build up, you'll be lucky if the punch line comes across as anything more than a flick.) I have just received - under plain cover & evidently for my own personal use - a superb studio photograph of one of our MOST distinguished members but who, by implication, asks to remain nameless. (Mind you, the hard hat, theodolite, rifle & pyotl plants are something of a giveaway.) While the face is rather grey & expressionless, the supporting torso glints with the kind of bronze sheen that I found churning up in my own breast feelings I never knew existed . I suspect he is too shy to accede to my request, but let me make a heartfelt plea that he release this gorgeous image for our more general pleasure. Scottie B. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 20:26:59 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q0Qx905345 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 20:26:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405252104.i4PL4Sn7019442@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 21:04:27 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org I sent one in Scottie. It is probably stuck on the bottom of Tim's bedroom slipper as he wanders around his apartment in his robe with a highball in hand, the NY Times under is arm and a cigarette hanging vertically from his lower lip, defying gravity. Daniel Now that some of us have let vanity prevail over shame, surely the rest of the shoal can venture out from behind that rock. We're dying to have a peep. Honest. Scottie B. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 20:26:57 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q0QvZ05325 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 20:26:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40B35A6F.5050405@drew.edu> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 10:38:39 -0400 From: James Rovira User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, de, de-at, de-de, fr-fr, es-pr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: More of the Rogues' Gallery References: <20040525141728.24436@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <20040525141728.24436@mail.panix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Ha...that photo of Matt Has to Be too old to count. Daniel looks like he hasn't changed at all, though. My, what a handsome fellow I am... :) Jim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 21:06:59 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q16xu07277 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:06:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: RE: New Yorker article & this year's Laughing Man Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:41:15 -0400 Message-Id: <20040526004115.29978@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <200405252051.i4PKpiEC013320@theseus.peterson.af.mil> References: <200405252051.i4PKpiEC013320@theseus.peterson.af.mil> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Tue, May 25, 2004, daniel.yocum@Peterson.af.mil said: >I saw this guy on Charlie Rose. I watch that show, maybe, twice a month >tops and you have mentioned just about every guest I've seen. Do >you NYer lit types roam around in herds, or what? >Daniel Sorry if I'm confused. Are you one of those left-wing commie type people who watch Charlie Rose? I myself avoid TV when I can because it's all so over my head, what with the ongoing beauty pageants and the pinhead parades. A lot of us read the NYer as if it were a samizdat publication. I'm not sure quite what we have in common. Maybe the cartoons? It's not like we are READERS or anything complicated like that. But don't worry; Adam Gopnik is a Canadian, so he won't be threatening our precious bodily fluids any time soon, Daniel. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 21:07:00 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q170D07293 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:07:00 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: RE: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:47:46 -0400 Message-Id: <20040526004746.10663@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <200405252104.i4PL4Sn7019442@theseus.peterson.af.mil> References: <200405252104.i4PL4Sn7019442@theseus.peterson.af.mil> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Tue, May 25, 2004, daniel.yocum@Peterson.af.mil said: >I sent one in Scottie. It is probably stuck on the bottom of >Tim's bedroom slipper as he wanders around his apartment in >his robe with a highball in hand, the NY Times under is arm >and a cigarette hanging vertically from his lower lip, >defying gravity. I can assure you that my lower lip never defies gravity. And I gave up drinking after my second liver transplant. I gave my robe away (too like Hugh Hefner) and still avoid carrying the NY Times because the ink smears more than I like. I'm not sure whether you are constrained in some way when it comes to reaching web sites (it happens to some people behind firewalls), but you should look here and see what you find: I think Scottie will attest that I am a classic TT, and as for the rest, well, you got the wrong guy, just like in those great death row cases where we kill the person who never got around to committing the actual crime. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 21:07:01 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q171007300 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:07:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <40B3E93F.4050407@drew.edu> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:47:59 -0400 From: James Rovira User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Subject: Re: Greetings and some questions References: <200405252055.i4PKtr7d015259@theseus.peterson.af.mil> In-Reply-To: <200405252055.i4PKtr7d015259@theseus.peterson.af.mil> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Hey...so I love office supplies...so shoot me... :). Jim Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE wrote: >Jim, you have the soul of a clerk. I picture you in a mega office supply >store like Office Depot or Office Max standing in the file folder aisle with >hunched shoulders glazed eyes and a puddle of piss pooling about your feet. >Daniel > > - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Tue May 25 21:07:00 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4Q170e07280 for bananafish-outgoing; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:07:00 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: RE: more pictures! more pictures! Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:42:41 -0400 Message-Id: <20040526004241.790@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <200405252058.i4PKwpgO016618@theseus.peterson.af.mil> References: <200405252058.i4PKwpgO016618@theseus.peterson.af.mil> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Tue, May 25, 2004, daniel.yocum@Peterson.af.mil said: >Come on guys, every time I open that web page I get the feeling >I'm passing time in line at the post office. Well ... there is always that high-tech option of not opening the page. It doesn't exactly spill into your lap, now, does it? --tim the messenger - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 26 15:25:59 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4QJPxa03300 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 26 May 2004 15:25:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405261452.i4QEqsa4006501@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: New Yorker article & this year's Laughing Man Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 14:52:47 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org I know you are confused and I accept your apology for it. No, no, I am one of those 'neocon' big brother types eaves dropping on all this surreptitious activity over the VHF air waves. I got a hold of an aerial for my tv from a friend's guy. I know you avoid tv and that a cultural person like yourself is incapable of grasping beauty on pageant or the wisdom of the vulgar on review. We know that your over sized cranium and pencil neck makes any tv watching unbearable. 'Samizdat'? interesting, indeed. Yes, and I suppose you occasionally wear jeans and a t-shirt while you walk about Manhattan to ascertain the status of the pin head proletariat. That 'us' is in constant need of contact with the fodder for the sake of your glorious revolution. "Maybe the cartoons?", Why else would "READERS" have in common, don't all swimmers get wet when they swim? But page after page, section after section of cartoons can get exhausting. What me worry? Canadian? The book synopsis states; "Much of this memoir concerning Gopnik's five-year experience as an American in Paris was printed as the New Yorker column...". So pin-headedness can be found among the "READERS"? "...threatening our precious bodily floods...", Tim, take some time off or your posts will be taken over by apologies for confusion. I'll cut this short, the fire dogs just delivered my breakfast burrito. Daniel Sorry if I'm confused. Are you one of those left-wing commie type people who watch Charlie Rose? I myself avoid TV when I can because it's all so over my head, what with the ongoing beauty pageants and the pinhead parades. A lot of us read the NYer as if it were a samizdat publication. I'm not sure quite what we have in common. Maybe the cartoons? It's not like we are READERS or anything complicated like that. But don't worry; Adam Gopnik is a Canadian, so he won't be threatening our precious bodily fluids any time soon, Daniel. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 26 15:26:00 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4QJQ0v03311 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 26 May 2004 15:26:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405261512.i4QFCon8015400@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: more pictures! more pictures! Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 15:12:47 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Huhh? My reply Messenger to the one that sent you is Huh? Daniel >Come on guys, every time I open that web page I get the feeling >I'm passing time in line at the post office. Well ... there is always that high-tech option of not opening the page. It doesn't exactly spill into your lap, now, does it? --tim the messenger - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 26 15:25:59 2004 Received: by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4QJPxf03306 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 26 May 2004 15:25:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <200405261511.i4QFBPYl014851@theseus.peterson.af.mil> From: Yocum Daniel R Civ 21 CES/CEOE To: "'bananafish@roughdraft.org'" Subject: RE: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 15:11:21 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Does it defy drool? Why, third one isn't free? Does your coachman or chamber maid carry it for you? Smeared ink, OH the humanity! I eventually found it after I managed to break my gaze from Valerie's picture, I mean Scottie's. Classic TT? Bedroom slippers, robes, high balls, and limp cigarettes are a crime these days? Man, you Manhattanites are worse than Salem Puritans. And, you'll never convince me that you have foresworn the committing of actual crimes. I didn't put you on death row, blame Kafka for all this supercilious self accusation, Autobiography with the principal role of that of the Martyr. I know you are a man of wealth and taste but am I still supposed to have a Rolling Stone's sympathy? Daniel I can assure you that my lower lip never defies gravity. And I gave up drinking after my second liver transplant. I gave my robe away (too like Hugh Hefner) and still avoid carrying the NY Times because the ink smears more than I like. I'm not sure whether you are constrained in some way when it comes to reaching web sites (it happens to some people behind firewalls), but you should look here and see what you find: I think Scottie will attest that I am a classic TT, and as for the rest, well, you got the wrong guy, just like in those great death row cases where we kill the person who never got around to committing the actual crime. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 26 21:17:46 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4R1Hk323671 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 26 May 2004 21:17:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000d01c4436f$3412e1a0$62a57dc2@j8l6n9> From: "Scottie Bowman" To: References: <200405252104.i4PL4Sn7019442@theseus.peterson.af.mil> <20040526004746.10663@mail.panix.com> Subject: Re: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 23:16:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org Well I, for one, think Tim's identification parade is a marvellous wheeze. I don't know the practice in the US, but the posher broadsheets on this side of the Atlantic carry small photographs of their columnists alongside their by-lines & it just adds that little homely touch that makes all the difference. I'm still hoping our own jokers & shrinking violets will stifle their vanity long enough to let the rest of us gaze, however briefly, on their contenances divine. We're all friends here, after all. Aren't we? The one glaring omission, of course, is the gallery owner himself: who is certainly no violet but perhaps, on this occasion, somewhat too shrinking a joker. Scottie B. - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH From oconnort@panix.com Wed May 26 21:38:45 2004 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by dont.panix.com (8.11.6p2-a/8.8.8/PanixLC1.7) id i4R1cjf24925 for bananafish-outgoing; Wed, 26 May 2004 21:38:45 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tim O'Connor" To: bananafish Subject: Re: come on in - the water's lovely Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 21:26:38 -0400 Message-Id: <20040527012638.21359@mail.panix.com> In-Reply-To: <000d01c4436f$3412e1a0$62a57dc2@j8l6n9> References: <000d01c4436f$3412e1a0$62a57dc2@j8l6n9> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.2.1 us Carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-bananafish@roughdraft.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: bananafish@roughdraft.org On Wed, May 26, 2004, rbowman@indigo.ie said: > Well I, for one, think Tim's identification parade > is a marvellous wheeze. Thanks. I'm glad you like it. > I don't know the practice in the US, but the posher > broadsheets on this side of the Atlantic carry small > photographs of their columnists alongside their by-lines > & it just adds that little homely touch that makes all > the difference. I'm still hoping our own jokers & > shrinking violets will stifle their vanity long enough > to let the rest of us gaze, however briefly, on their > contenances divine. We're all friends here, after all. Some of our papers do that as well. I suppose sometimes we are friends. (Though I mostly look at messages here with an eye toward whether they are spam or infectious ... occasionally I make the same stupid mistake of answering silly troll mail, and it nearly always reminds me of why I stopped bothering with many of the messages. Life is too short for the silliness.) > The one glaring omission, of course, is the gallery owner > himself: who is certainly no violet but perhaps, on this > occasion, somewhat too shrinking a joker. When I get home, when I get home. I shall have to focus on the chiaroscuro, especially. --tim - * Unsubscribing? Mail majordomo@roughdraft.org with the message * UNSUBSCRIBE BANANAFISH