Subject: Re: Cheever and Salinger
From: Jim Rovira (jrovira@drew.edu)
Date: Fri Jun 21 2002 - 14:13:40 EDT
Ok, that's more credible, thanks. Lemme make sure I have the details of the
story down right.
Sybil saw 6 tigers.
Seymour said bananafish got caught with 78 bananas in their mouth (seemed like
b-fish were plural here).
Sybil said she saw one bananafish with 6 bananas in its mouth while she was
with Seymour.
So you're saying that since the b-fish had 6, instead of 78, bananas in its
mouth, it may escape?
Yeah, maybe ;). I can see that.
I could see Seymour kissing Sybil's feet both because she allowed him a way of
escape (I think identifying Seymour with the bananafish is almost a foregone
conclusion...we need to look somewhere for the reason for Seymour's suicide),
or just because he was pleased that she was entering his imaginative world.
Jim
midge immington wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I'm not saying that six nor 78 per se are symbolic.
> What I think is interesting is that Sybil first says
> re the tigers "only six" in response to Seymour's "so
> many". Then in the bananafish scene, he refers to 78
> as an example of the tragedy of the bananafish getting
> trapped and not being able to get out. When Sybil
> sees the bananafish it is again six. In both cases
> she's offering an opposing view to his. (There is the
> constancy of the child with six.) This bananafish
> will be able to get out--after all, she sees 6 bananas
> not 78. If at one level Seymour is the bananafish, he
> then realizes he will be able to escape his dilemma of
> being trapped--hence the kiss.
>
> Bye!
> Midge
>
> --- Jim Rovira <jrovira@drew.edu> wrote:
> > ok, what? What I see is wordplay :). Sybil said
> > she saw six tigers. For
> > that reason, she then said she saw a bananafish with
> > six bananas in her
> > mouth. What does the number do beyond provide a
> > basis for wordplay in
> > Seymour/Sybil's dialog?
> >
> > What, then, is the point of a single bananafish
> > eating as many as "78"
> > bananas? Rather than running to a Kabbalistic
> > interpretation of 78, common
> > sense tells me that everyone's just pulling numbers
> > out of their heads :).
> >
> > There's no point is saying "it has to mean
> > something" unless you can say
> > what that something is, and give specific reasons
> > for linking that specific
> > something to Salinger or the story.
> >
> > It's not enough to just say that Salinger read a
> > source. He read a lot
> > :). That doesn't mean everything he read influenced
> > every story he wrote.
> >
> > Jim
> >
> > midge immington wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Jim Rovira <jrovira@drew.edu> wrote:
> > >
> > > My point was not that the number was
> > absolutely insignificant,
> > > but we need
> > > to consider the possibility that it may be.
> > And that, if we are
> > > going to
> > > make associations, they can't be random or
> > simply guided by our
> > > own
> > > imagination -- Salinger himself would have to
> > give us reasons
> > > for that
> > > association. Sticking to the context of the
> > story, the number 6
> > > doesn't
> > > seem to recur, so it's not given any
> > significance that way.
> > >
> > > ***
> > > Hi!
> > >
> > > "I thought they'd never stop. I never saw so
> > many tigers."
> > >
> > > "There were only six," Sybil said.
> > >
> > > "*Only* six!" said the young man. "Do you
> > call that *only*?"
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [two pages later Seymour says]:
> > >
> > > "Why, I've known some bananafish to swim into
> > a banana hole and
> > > eat as many as seventy-eight bananas."
> > >
> > > [next page]:
> > >
> > > "I just saw one."
> > >
> > > "Saw what, my love?"
> > >
> > > "A bananafish."
> > >
> > > "My God, no!" said the young man. "Did he
> > have any bananas in
> > > his mouth?"
> > >
> > > "Yes," said Sybil. "Six."
> > >
> > > The young man suddenly picked up one of
> > Sybil's wet feet, which
> > > were drooping over the end of the float, and
> > kissed the arch.
> > >
> > > ***
> > >
> > > Something's going on!
> > >
> > > --Midge
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
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