Re: a few answers

J J R (jrovira@juno.com)
Fri, 06 Nov 1998 16:43:07 -0500 (EST) 

Scottie--

I said what I said because I am who I am--Paul didn't make me do
anything.  Since I was replying to what I perceived as a sarcastic post,
I wanted to say as clearly and directly as possible what I was feeling. 
Leaving out the Fuck You at the end (or was it a Fuck Off?  I don't
remember) would have been a bit less than honest--because, of course,
nothing else was really intended--lecture about Shakespeare and
Elizabethan England's attitude toward the Jews notwithstanding.

My reaction to Paul was Over the Top because I wasn't reacting Just To
Paul, but to what I perceived as a studied ignorance across the boards. 
I think you understand frustration with that, however unwilling you may
be to admit it at the moment.  

Paul was just the latest winner, but certainly not the worst offender.

RE: Teaching as a profession.

I'm assuming your generalities apply to English in particular, and
Liberal arts majors in general.  I think you believe in good teaching
when it comes to medical school, engineering programs, and other sciences
because, well, someone's life may literally depend on someone else being
"well-taught" in those fields.

You need to account for the possibility--I'm not even going to call this
a fact, now, just a possibility--that other people's experiences may be
different from yours.  A good English professor will not necessarily
teach their students What to think about a book, but How to think about a
book.  I've had a few that did indeed project their neuroses onto works
of fiction, but pathetically few.  So few, in fact, that from my
experience I would say that's the exception rather than the rule.

But, it is possible I've just been very lucky.

And you need to ask yourself what you write about when you write,
Scottie.  I suspect, like others, you write about what you perceive as
real life.  My experience of having been taught English on a college
level has been such that I've learned a great deal about life--the life I
confront every day--through my study of literature, and through
literature have been given glimpses of certain facets of that real life
that I wouldn't have otherwise had the opportunity to see.

I didn't major in English because I couldn't do anything else--my first
two years of college I maintained a 4.0 in all subjects--math and science
as well as literature.  Yeah, I could have just completed my Engineering
degree from a very reputable school in my area.  Yeah, I could be making
more money right now.  But English is what I love--the study of
literature is what I love--and I can't see myself pursuing any other
course of study.
   
Don't know if this helps any.  I doubt it.

Jim  

On Fri, 06 Nov 1998 09:08:53 +0000 Scottie Bowman <bowman@mail.indigo.ie>
writes:
>
>	When Martin said to himself:  `...To think that I'm actually 
>	being PAID to sit around and talk about books and poetry 
>	with these great people -  I'd gladly do it for free..', he 
>was 
>	unwittingly admitting there was something rather phoney about 
>	the whole setup.  
>
>	Chatting about books is something civilised people do over 
>	a dinner table, over a few drinks, or even through the medium 
>	of a mailing list.  The profession of teachers is one of 
>	the shameful professions - like that of social workers, of 
>bank 
>	robbers or of psychiatrists - attracting, by its nature, the 
>very 
>	last people who should be practising it & existing - like the 
>others 
>	- for the benefit of the practitioners rather than their 
>clients.  
>
>	The gain for a teacher is a captive audience of impressionable 
>minds 
>	(almost certainly over-impressionable if it's an English 
>class...) 
>	that he is paid - modestly but reliably - to fill up with his 
>own 
>	private & neurotic preoccupations, using as his pretext & 
>piggy-back 
>	work by elementally more gifted & harder working people.
>
>	Leaving aside Diego's distaste for my particular sense of 
>humour - 
>	his own is not immediately apparent - I assure him that my 
>advice 
>	to Nicola was completely serious.  I really do think that 
>university 
>	courses in English are (like most non-technical instruction) a 
>
>	complete waste of time.  It so happens that Ted Hugh's example 
>
>	was peculiarly topical but that doesn't detract from its 
>relevance. 
>	He was speaking & acting for many of us, & especially those 
>who 
>	long to write & enjoy living English - not just regurgitate it 
>in 
>	dreary dollops for the benefit of other prisoners in the 
>academic 
>	galley.
>
>	My congratulations to Paul for having ruffled - at last - 
>Jim's 
>	Christian forbearance.  How refreshing to find a healthy fuck 
>off 
>	behind all those jovial heh, heh, hehs....  It hasn't been 
>seen 
>	before - certainly not in my time on the list.
>
>	Except, Matt, that I don't really have time for the hammer, 
>	the thongs & the 8 inch nails, are you really serious in your 
>plea 
>	for urbane, intelligent conversation ?  Doesn't your heart 
>sink when 
>	you open yet another earnest disquisition on the Australian 
>Post 
>	Structuralist view of Cosmic Blandness ?  I must admit mine 
>only 
>	really quickens when I open one of Dr Kosusko's little 
>packages 
>	& recognise the glint of the stiletto or hear the distant 
>plonk when 
>	one of my own pebbles reaches the bottom of the well.  Art & 
>	the lively consideration of art stops being serious the moment 
>
>	respectful solemnity appears on the scene.
>
>	Scottie B.
>	
>

___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]